PULSE AUTOCYCLE NETWORK

shannonflyguy · Joined: 21 Feb 2010 Posts: 2 Location: Saint Paul, In

I know that might seem to be a redundant question given all the discussions in here about new designs, but I'm curious if the real interest level is there to actually support and grow a new design. Assuming the car looks good and the engineering is tested, I just can't help but believe that with gas prices like they are and all the interest in hybrids that a new autocycle could be successful.

In the interests of full disclosure, I'm asking because I already do fiberglass work for RC planes, I'm a pilot, and I just bought a set of full sized airplane molds, the front 3/4 of which would lend itself to autocycle conversion quite nicely.

Bob Hichborn · Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 404 Location: Orlando, Fl

If I were going to redesign the Pulse, I think I'd convert it to a reverse trike design, similar to the T-Rex or Aptera.

You'd have to think about seating layouts. Single passenger makes for the most economical design, but reduces it's use. Tandem calls for a longer vehicle like the Pulse and Side By Side makes for a wider vehicle like the Aptera.

I'm not a fan of outriggers, fixed or retractable. Fixed outriggers have just too many design issues and retractable outriggers on enclosed vehicle can be subject to malfunctions and side winds. The owners of the Ecomobiles that I met last year love their vehicles but have some very interesting stories of just flopping over at stop lights or parking areas, as well as, having to lean their vehicles over at dangerous angles just to drive straight down the road in high cross winds.

Fixed outriggers like on the Pulse, drag during turning which is why they wear out after about 1000 miles, and the vehicle is subject to side to side oscillations or adversely affecting the weight distribution to the vehicles front and rear wheels during operation, because they tend to carry a portion of the weight during operation instead of just keeping it balanced.

The 2F1R design has been shown to be superior in handling over the 1F2R, but that performance is also dependent on proper weight distribution from front to rear. Too light in the rear affects your drive wheel traction and too light up front obviously affects steering.

Although, I've been working on a design for a single seat electric 1F2R Pulse, just because I have the frame and body components, at the end of the day I'd go for an enclosed T-Rex design minus the $40,000 price tag.

-Bob
_________________
"Everyday you wake up with a Pulse,
is a good day!"

shannonflyguy · Joined: 21 Feb 2010 Posts: 2 Location: Saint Paul, In

The existing airplane molds I bought are side by side seating, so the 2 in front 1 in rear wheel arrangement seems most appropriate.

Miraculix · Joined: 08 Apr 2007 Posts: 3 Location: Germany

elden simons · Joined: 11 Sep 2003 Posts: 369 Location: Brampton, Michigan

A 2For. 1'r (my rewrite of the steering and drive design) of the Pulse will have to meet "my" design requirements!

(Forum receives historic number of replies under this subject, all stating: Build it Yourself!)

Just kidding around.
I still would like that any new production of the Pulse would keep the original design of the body and nasa side inlets.

How about keeping the same seating arrangement for two, yet cantilever the cockpit so as the steering is under and just back of the driver. The weight that is from the driver forward is negligable. The weight that is Aft from there is the combination of passenger, engine, fuel, main frame...

Maybe hard to mentally picture.

The one nightmare would be the steering since it would have to be redirected from the control area that is forward of the operator and then redirected to the responding wheels.
With this proposed design possibility, a pseudo wing design may yet be incorporated to keep the mini jet theme.

My memory has it that four years ago, a brief member posted a design from an enterprising individual in Germany of an airplane influenced vehicle that allowed side-by-side seating and no outriggers.

It didn't have the best of style, but still neat to look at.

Miraculix · Joined: 08 Apr 2007 Posts: 3 Location: Germany

Miraculix · Joined: 08 Apr 2007 Posts: 3 Location: Germany

elden simons · Joined: 11 Sep 2003 Posts: 369 Location: Brampton, Michigan

Miraculix,

I tried to locate the vehicle, but no luck yet. Even looked through archived Forum postings.

lite9dave · Joined: 27 Feb 2004 Posts: 40 Location: Seattle

One of the reasons I bought my Litestar was to study the design with the thought of making something similar, but smoothing out some of the rough edges. Now that I've owned it for some time I've seen a lot more rough edges than I realized existed.

I backed off on my plans for designing and building an updated vehicle when a few years back I heard about the V1 by Venture Vehicles (Later changed to Persu). That design seemed to incorporate a lot of what I wanted and I only had to write a check, not undergo another multi-year project (have had too many of those).

Unfortunately it appears that Persu Mobility is functionally defunct and that their vehicle may never appear. Unless something better comes along soon I guess I need to get back to the drawing board.

-Dave-

StillWishing · Posted: Sat May 08, 2010 12:23 am Post subject:

As long as I have wanted to buy a Pulse, I have also thought about a redesign of the outrigger. Even more after reading many posts here about how fast the tires wear out and the side to side movement.

My thought was to change the outriggers to look like an F-14 with the wings swept back.

The concept being to get the outrigger axles in line with the rear drive wheel axle and bring the outrigger wheels in closer to the center line of the vehicle. Since they would be in line and closer together, this would eliminate the sideways dragging of the outrigger wheels while cornering. Then I would like to create a horizontal suspension that would allow the Pulse to lean side to side and hiding all of this under a rear mock up of the tail of the F-14.

I guess the configuration would be called 1F3R. Sounds ambitious, right?
_________________
---Bob---

Waiting for my dream to come true

Bob Hichborn · Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 404 Location: Orlando, Fl

Bob,
The Acabion is close to what you were thinking about.
www.acabion.com

It takes a while to load, because they seemed to think loading and displaying fireworks was a cool marketing angle.

If you have the patience, watch some of the actual driving videos. It's interesting to note that you never see it without the outriggers up. Ooops.... "we forgot about that whole "balance thing" in our computer simulations."

It's still very cool looking. The whole cockpit area actually looks like someone pulled a mold off a BD5, then extenced it to the rear. Nice work overall and balancing isn't that important when you look that good. Just ask us Pulse owners. Smile

- Bob
_________________
"Everyday you wake up with a Pulse,
is a good day!"

StillWishing · Posted: Fri May 14, 2010 4:04 am Post subject:

The Acabion is an interesting vehicle, but I like the look of having outriggers that appear to be wings. I just want to get the outrigger wheels set back to where there would be no side drag when turning or cornering. I think the F-14 look would accomplish that.

Some day when I have the $$ and time........
_________________
---Bob---

Waiting for my dream to come true

Obie115 · Joined: 09 May 2010 Posts: 26 Location: Lake Arrowhead Ca.

Has anyone in the forum ever looked at just extending the outriggers back so that they are more in line with the rear wheels and mabey a little closer in toward the frame so that the side loading would be les but you would still have the staibility?

Steve O
_________________
My Pulse is 115 and I am lovin it

elden simons · Joined: 11 Sep 2003 Posts: 369 Location: Brampton, Michigan

Obie 1 (kan-obie),
Yes, yes...it has been considered, but not expanded on. Thankyou for bringing it up again so our newer members can chew on the thought.

So, with the outriggers in line with the rear wheel what will the new problem(s) be?
What will the benefits be?

Bring the outriggers closer to the frame / body: Benefits? Problems?
---------------------------------

Not personally having any Engineering background, I can only make assumptions.

Swept back outriggers would look nice. The torsion limitation rods might have to be reconfigured to mount after the rear tire (control of stabilizer flex/give.

Bringing the outriggers in closer to the frame, I'd think would make some turns even hairier. The tilt of body in some turns (Exit Ramps, tight curved roads) would overcome the stabilization and be similar to problems had by many car/suv makers that have vehicles lose control or topple. The Pulse G.C.R.V. is of high center of gravity in left/right axis.

Obie115 · Joined: 09 May 2010 Posts: 26 Location: Lake Arrowhead Ca.

I was thinking that you might keep the shape of the outriggers about the same and just extend the fiberglass and frame back so that it is inline with the rear wheels. I am not sure weather you would have to bring the outrigger wheels in a little closer or keep them at the same distance, not being an enginer myself I am not sure of the stability problems or the support it would take for the outriggers that far back. It does appear that the Pulse has such a low center of gravity you might get away with this configuration. You might even be able to extend the body a bit further for more room for the passenger and a larger powerplant.
_________________
My Pulse is 115 and I am lovin it

Bob Hichborn · Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 404 Location: Orlando, Fl

Someday I'll update this sketch, but the idea is to actually remove the rear center wheel and use bigger wheels as drive wheels instead of outriggers which are just for balance. Essentially, just making a "Pulse trike". There's plenty of axle assemblies on the market for trikes these days. You could stay with the donor motorcycle concept or go electric.

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1353791842038589010dDHfAe

- Bob
_________________
"Everyday you wake up with a Pulse,
is a good day!"

Obie115 · Joined: 09 May 2010 Posts: 26 Location: Lake Arrowhead Ca.

Great looking Pulse Trike Bob, have you gone any further with the design other than the sketch? Would there be a problem with extending the frame to include the passenger as my wife likes to go wherevever I go. Have you considered just using the original frame for the pulse and adapting the drive train to the rear end?

I know always all of the questions...... It would just be nice to have a reliable piece of transportation that has the looks of the Pulse and the gass milage in the 50 or 60 miles to gallon range that can be driven in all weather and thats fun to drive and turns heads.

Steve O
_________________
My Pulse is 115 and I am lovin it

Bob Hichborn · Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 404 Location: Orlando, Fl

Two of the Pulses I have are using the Honda GL1100 as donor power plants. It would be a relatively easy task to pull the rear wheel assembly and integrate/fabricate something similar to the Mototrike or Lehman Goldwing setups that are already out in the market. Before production outfits started making trikes for the mass market, customizers have been using light truck rearends with great success.

The more involved job would be creating an appealing and integrated looking Delta or swept wing look to the back wheels.

Overall it would be a fun project and eliminate all the issues associated with the Pulses outrigger wheels.

I'm working on improving the Pulse computer model I have, so maybe in the future I can take a shot at a mockup.

- Bob
_________________
"Everyday you wake up with a Pulse,
is a good day!"

Scott Denison · Joined: 07 Jun 2010 Posts: 4 Location: Twin Cities MN

The F-14 swept wings would look great. Add in a tilting trike rear end and it would fly like "the coolest bike ever" should. Crank and Bank! Check out: www.mysterydesigns.com Their Tiltster.
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Scott Denison

Bob Hichborn · Joined: 12 Feb 2004 Posts: 404 Location: Orlando, Fl

Scott,

I checked out the link.... nice bit of engineering, a tad pricey, but none the less, if you want a good design, made with good materials, it's going to cost you.

I was curious, in that the site says they can integrate their suspension with any belt or chain drive, but then they mention the Goldwings, which are all shaft driven. They don't display any products using a drive shaft, so not sure what their solution is for that. ??? I'd also like to see a rear wider than 41 inches, especially with the length of the Pulse.

Ultimately, I'd like to ride something like the GM Lean Machine, Carver, Clever, or Venturer.

- Bob
_________________
"Everyday you wake up with a Pulse,
is a good day!"